My status May concerning the “picture count question”

[StephanFink]

 So far, I have posted my regular status updates in comments under the good posts and infos on the topic by @MortenCopenhagen  and @WilfriedB  (link>). Now I'm putting my factual analysis, my personal impressions and conclusions in a separate post.

If you have similar or different experiences, or even more recent information on the status, I would be happy if you would post them in a comment. (as I follow the discussion in the above posts closely, I am very familiar with most of the information) 

Three month after the Count clash in February, my analytics showed the following facts. 

There are again regular updates on the numbers regarding image views, but by no means for all images

• -For my top 50 images, there were updates for about 70 percent of the images (some of them several times a week, some once a month)
• Many of these updates occur with a similar percentage of 1.0X percent (does Google now update when 1.0X % new views have occurred?)
• -In most cases, the growth rates are light years below the previous values, only some images have monthly growth rates in the dimension of the double-digit numbers known from before February. The images in question are all in the top positions (mostly rank 1, sometimes 2 or 3)
• Seven of my top 10 have not yet been updated. 

A real pattern is not recognizable. But it is reasonable to assume that the gap in the count of the last three months will NOT be closed/corrected. (as with the correction in the week around March 6th. - see chart)

The number of my weekly increases (see chart) across all images is now around 40% of the values before February. Although I have increased the number of my pictures by just over 30 percent in the last three months. (we had a few nice trips / trips to exciting places 😉) 

With around 2,000 new uploads in the last three months, I have a pretty good overview of what's happening with new images at the moment.

• There are usually 3-7 days between upload and start of counting, but in some cases more than four weeks. (Less than 1% of images are not counted at all) 
• I find it striking that from my mix of images, images of restaurants, stores, touristic facilities and event spots (commercial locations) are counted and updated relatively promptly, while images of popular classic sights or other public facilities (non-commercial) are recorded noticeably later and updated less frequently. 
• This pattern also applies to images that I uploaded before February 2024.

I also find the gap between the views of reviews (see picture) and the view numbers of the associated images worth mentioning.

How can it be that a review is viewed 7,600+ times (see pictures) and the picture views are only seen or counted 550+ times? (or does only the click on a picture count now?) 

This could - presumably - also explain the reduced growth of numbers of other images from reviews. I myself have only uploaded a small number of my images via reviews.

Whether the observed numbers and patterns are now the “new normal”, actually mean a “commercial first” or the numbers will be lower in the future due to “new” methodology, one can only speculate. I am just as excited as you are to see what happens next. 

It should be clear that I am just as unhappy with Google's management and communication of the issue as you are. Over 100 million uploaders and local guides would have deserved a little more.

Nevertheless, I remain optimistic, because I post more for my personal, very private travel map anyway, my memories and at the places that have inspired me with great impressions, good food, a nice stay or an exceptional service.

[Calla57]

Hallo @StephanFink ,

Vielen Dank für deine Analyse  

Ich  kann das alles nur bestätigen. 

Bei mir ist das alles auch so,nur

auf einem niedrigen  Niveau. 🙃

[WilfriedB]

Guten Morgen @StephanFink 
Until earlier this year, I never tracked the number of views shown in my contributions, so I don't have any comparison except the one with most. For that I can say, on February 7 it dropped to a value it already had on December 27 and never changed since. The count of the second and third did change 5 respective 8 times since Feb 7.
Since the end of last year, I am tracking where and when I did post which of my photos - initially ignoring the views, since I never trusted those numbers. To do so, I requested a takeout occasionally since January 2024. Since the Jason-files also show the number of views, I record them also in my database (at the time still believing the numbers are the same as displayed under contributions).
After the "Event", I put more emphasis on tracking the views also. Thanks to @makoshark's approach, I am able now to track the numbers for each individual picture and came to the following conclusions:

• The numbers shown under contributions are changed only once a day (before Feb 2024 it "seemed" they changed in real time)
• Every night (CET) the numbers of only 6-13% of photos are updated.
• Only 1,1% of my photos were updated every night during the last 7 days (0,8% during the last 14 days or longer).
• 60% of my photos did not change at all during the last 2 weeks or longer.
• The 10 oldest photos showing no views were posted on March 2.
• 121 out of 410 uploaded since February 6, show no views.
• Some of the pictures posted on April 26 and May 2 already do show few numbers.
• More than 80% of the numbers recorded in the takeouts are bigger, than those shown under contributions.
• Some of the remaining 20% permanently display considerably bigger numbers under contributions.
• Unfortunately, I don't know how many of my photos did not update the views at all since February 7.
• The total number of views shown under contributions is updated almost daily, but with some interruptions, i.e. a few times not changing for two or three days. When the number changes, it shows exactly the same number, I added up, a day before in the morning (i.e. 24 hours before), which proofs, individual numbers are changed only more than once a day.

I don't care much about the absolut numbers - they don't tell us much anyway, but the fact that half of the uploaded photos are not updated at all, is not a good sign. Specially, if the percentage mentioned in my second bullet doesn't increase over time, we cannot expect any improvement soon.

[StephanFink]

Hi Wilfried,

Thx für die zusätzlichen Infos. Wir werden sehen, was noch kommt. 

Besten Gruß & einen schönen Tag

[Claus57]

Thank you / Dankeschoen for the detailed analysis. I have not done the same level of quantitative analysis but can confirm the trends qualitatively

- my top pics (some with over 1,000,000 views do not appear to be updating at all

- for new pics , it seems to be erratic. Before the crash, a new pic would immediately gather 10 or 20 views and then the number of views appeared to be updated in real time. Now many new pics stay at 0 counts for several days or longer. Other seem to be updating at a reasonable rate but still slower than before February

- I must confess, while I am trying not be like a teenager counting "likes" this situation take s out the fun of and motivation for posting.  One could specalulate that google was overwhelmed by the amount of data  being uploaded and wanted to reduce the load?

Claus (Sacramento, CA)

[WilfriedB]

Thanks for the confirmation @Claus57 !

Regarding "One could speculate that google was overwhelmed by the amount of data being uploaded and wanted to reduce the load?":

I don't know, if the amount of data matters and don't believe so, but I strongly believe they did reduce all kind of resources supporting local guides:

• A while ago somebody mentioned, the Local Guides Connect forum is not running on Google's servers but managed by another organization,
• Only very few moderators are Google employees,instead the most active are all volunteers,
• Updating the views only once a day, needs less IT resources compared to real time,
• Updating only ~10% of all photos daily, reduces the workload even more.

While the first three points sound reasonable to me, I cannot believe updating only a fraction of all media regularly, makes sense on a longer term.

[StephanFink]

Hi Claus,

die von Dir genannten Erfahrungen, decken sich mit den Erfahrungen der vielen Lokal Guides, die diese schon in den von mir oben genannten Beiträgen von @WilfriedB und @MortenCopenhagen eingestellt haben.

An einen Absturz glaube ich aber eher weniger.  Der von mir beobachte und auch im Kommentar von WilfriedB genannte Rückgang der Frequenz der Zählungen,  dürfte eher andere Gründe haben.

Wenn man die Diskussion über die Reduktion von Crawling-Zyklen und -Tiefe bei Websites beobachtet, erkennt man die Bestrebungen zur Reduktion von Rechnerzeit und Energieverbrauch. Bei Maps sind wir jetzt anscheinend weg von milliardenfachen Echtzeit-Updates (nach Uploads, Bildzugriffen).  Zuden gibt es vordergründig (ggf nur temporär) auch keine kalkulierbar regelmäßigen,Updates (z.B. täglichen) der Zahlen. Das alles spart eine Menge ein.

Inwieweit darüberhinaus die bisherigen, uns allen unbekannten Zählmethoden und auch Orte der Zählungen modifiziert wurden, können wir nur spekulieren.  Da die in Maps hochgeladenen Bilder u.a. in Maps an Orten, bei übergeordneten Orten, in Rezensionen oder auch in den Ergebnissen der Google-Suche,  oder irgendwo sonstwo angezeigt werden, gibt es auch hier jede Menge an  Gestaltungsoptionen.  Die großen Zahlen & Wachstumsraten in der Vergangenheit konnte ich mir nur über diese Vielzahl an möglichen Quellen,  insbesondere die Google-Suche, erklären.

Ich habe auch einige Bilder mit über einer Million Views (Top1 liegt bei 15 Mio+).  Die Top-6 haben bislang auch keine neuen Updates und liegen alle an den jeweiligen, recht popolären Orten auf Platz 1-3, müssten also gesehen werden. Vergleichbares beobachte ich aber auch über alle Bilder, wobei ich fühlbare Unterschiede bei den Ortstypen erkenne, wie in meinem Beitrag schön erwähnt.

Bleiben wir optimistisch. Irgendwie geht das "Spiel" nach ggf. neuen Regeln weiter, bis ... irgendwann die KI genug aus unseren Bilder gelernt hat, unsere alten Bilder gelöscht und nur ganz neue Bilder akzeptiert werden, mit deren Hilfe dann jeden Tag das neue Bild der Welt nachgezeichnet wird. Was früher war verschwindet.  Das wäre dann aber nicht mehr meine Veranstaltung.

Besten Gruß

Nachtrag: den letzten Kommentar von @WilfriedB habe ich erst nach dem Schreiben entdeckt. Sorry für die Redundanzen.

[Claus57]

Danke fuer deinen ausfuehrlichen Kommentar. Du hast recht, es war wahrscheinlich kein Crash, sondern eine absichtliche Aenderung, vielleicht eine mit "unintended consequences". Waers schoen wenigsten irgendein System zu erkennen.

Gruesse aus California

Claus

[Yaryman]

@StephanFink - Thanks for starting the thread and providing the data. 
Just looked at my top 10 photos. All still show in the first/top spot.
No increase in displayed views since "the event" except for the one time in Feb. I think it was when Google "tried" to solve the problem. 
Before the event I was going along at about 500K views a week. 
Since the event I have added about 500 images. A good week now is 400K views with 500 more photos, and no views from top 10 photos. 

Nothing about the counting makes any sense. 
I have a March photo with 45K views ( my best since "the event" ), but the Google takeout number for the photo is 600K views. 

Why is Google counting views one way, and displaying another completely different number?? 
Does Google know why? 

I fear one day the news will drop that the Local Guides Program will have the same fate as Google+. 
I certainly enjoyed getting the higher view numbers, but do also use the system as a travel map. So I will continue to add photos, but maybe not photos of mundane places that add to count, but don't add a new location to the map. 
Here is my Europe travel map. I live on the other side of the pond from this map.